I emotionally understand this idealistic view. But you can’t exclude yourself from the economy and exclude yourself from professional collaboration of any kind by switching from Photoshop to GIMP.
Proprietary software I use on a regular basis with no Linux alternative:
Revit, AutoCAD, Houdini, 3dsMAX, SolidWorks, Rhino, Grasshopper, Adobe Illustrator/Photoshop/InDesign (and/or their Affinity alternatives), CUDA optimized simulation and rendering plugins, etc.
I use at least one of these every day, almost none of them have any functioning compatibility with Wine or other emulation. Even just using Affinity has caused some issues with team projects when someone picks up where I left off and there’s no layer information and a ton of clipping groups instead.
If all you do with your computer is program, work with documents, use a web browser, and play video games sure go wild don’t use Windows on any of your machines. But I just don’t understand how some people in the FOSS community cannot fathom that there are entire professional workflows and industries that just have zero possibility of moving to Linux.
Do I like using Windows? No. But I do like being able to use all the programs my work and research requires.
I contribute actual, tangible research into FOSS CAD/CAM/BIM software development and implementation. I love it and want to see FOSS options grow and become widely adopted. But it just isn’t anywhere close to having feature parity. And that matters, just as much as industry interoperability matters.
I’m just so tired of this thought process in the community that the only reason someone isn’t using Linux/FOSS is because they’re some fanboy or something
It’s a chicken-egg problem. People stay away from Linux because Linux can’t run (or at least very flawed) industry standard programs like Adobes catalogue and those proprietary software publishers wont publish for Linux because there aren’t enough Linux users to be worth the “trouble”.
But that’s just a part of the problem, the true offender, are the goalpost-movers. “Linux cant run A, that’s why I NEED to stay on windows. What? A now runs flawlessly? Well there’s also B which is really important!” No matter how many programs get ported or at least near flawlessly emulated, there will always be one more program our jack-of-all-trades absolutely can’t live without.
To be honest, sometimes it’s just easier to use Windows, for compatibility sake. Sure, I can install Office or Photoshop through Wine, but some software can just be a pain in the neck to install and use on Linux.
This is the main reason why I dual boot and will most probably for a very very long time. I just don’t have the time to tackle with these things ATM, real life is more important.
There is a trade off i guess if you put it that way. Would you rather tinker and make your software work for you, or would you install a shitty bloated operating system that routinely trades your data like pokemon cards just so you can install a handful of programs.
I would rather tinker to be honest, I am that kind of a person, but currently, my family (kid) needs me. He’s young and needs guidance, playing, attention, etc. That is more important than tinkering with tech IMO.
Yeah, let me just change my profession real quick, fuck the 20 years I have invested. I’ll just do a tapdance on my eyelashes for the neckbeards and everybody will be happy weee
LOL wait till the company your proprietary software relies on tanks or makes a shitty change for their benefit.
It’s sad you built a career out of black box code lmao. I guess 20 years isn’t enough to read the writing on the wall: proprietary code is shit. Black boxes are shit. I piss on your profession
Companies are always going to make shitty changes, but that doesn’t change the reality that industry leaders are usually in that position for a reason. You simply cannot replace After Effects without kneecapping yourself. GIMP is nowhere near as capable as Photoshop. It is impossible to develop iOS apps without Xcode, and difficult/unsupported to develop Android without Android Studio.
You can piss off your high horse as much as you want, but it is fantastical to claim that professions should hamstring their work and sacrifice reality and practicality for the sake of some ideology belief. Companies aren’t choosing these standards because they love giving away money, they’re doing it because they recognise that rejecting a $300 annual expense for $10,000 worth of greater productivity is financially irresponsible.
See this neckbeard extremist evangelising is why people stay away from Linux community. Linux hobbyists having 0 concerns for others’ jobs, work or needs is incredibly icky. I advocate for FLOSS, but posts like this just gives more ammunition to Windows/MacOS/proprietary culture fanboys.
OP said this to a poster below:
It’s sad you built a career out of black box code lmao. […] I piss on your profession
Is it that top of the line software truly doesn’t exist for linux, that it’s impossible to the work done, or is it possible BUT you have to spend more time tinkering and learning the quirks of quite admittedly rough around the edges open source software? That yes, it’s less efficient, but actually more rewarding knowing that the software you worked on was open source. And one you actually learn how to use open source software, nobody can take it away from you.
Look at unity! They gutted the program through its egregious licensing structure and now people are scrambling for alternatives. People that sticked with Godot didn’t have the same trouble. It was just another Wednesday
Of course open source can’t play on the same level as proprietary software right now. It doesn’t have the same money thrown at it than proprietary software! But the appeal of open source is that every change is guaranteed to benefit you, not some arbitrary bottom line. Proprietary software is polished, but you are at the whims of a big tech company.
If i were to base my profession on software, spend literal years of my life depending on code, i really would fucking like to look inside that shit sometimes. Anything else is like building a skyscraper out of quicksand
It’s great to use open source software. But once you need to use CAD for work, you’re gonna use the most efficient tool you can find no matter what OS it requires.
Also you CAN get your workplace to shift over to something else.
Not every workplace will change procedures, but some will. Especially if it’s software that handles local data or if there are high costs or privacy risks, they can be convinced.
You’re gonna get a whole team of people retrained with software they’re not used to, probably doesn’t have proper support or learning resources to fall back on, and may lack features or compatibility?
They might save some money, but a lot of businesses are more than happy to pay a lot to ensure they don’t have to worry about the above, and they can get on with their company’s actual purpose.
Well companies continue to get new software and learn new skills. They might not switch as soon as you suggest it, but it could get revisited later on when renewing a contract.
This also depends a lot on the size of the team and the work that’s being done. If required features are missing or there are compatibility issues, then that’s one thing. If people prefer the other product, or enough workers share similar views on the topic, then it’s easier to switch.
Again it doesn’t happen all the time, but it’s worth bringing up. If anything, it shows you’re thinking about how to improve your work and the business (financially, ethically). I’ve seen times when changes were made, and I’ve seen times when it wasn’t.
You’re gonna get a whole team of people retrained with software they’re not used to, probably doesn’t have proper support or learning resources to fall back on, and may lack features or compatibility?
Like the jump from Windows 10 to Windows 11? People move to unfamiliar software all the time, then complain about it for a bit and then cope.
I hope you are kidding, trolling, as those things, plus audio/video editing, started fron unix when it wasn’t conceivable to do so on PCs with proprietary OS. All those corporations who later sold such sw copied/stole FOSS and dressed it up as their own.
No team or corporation can ever ever catch up to FOSS development. It is a neo-liberal fallacy that promotes them on marketing hype.
Yeah, but people who bring these things up act like everyone needs these things to get their day to day work done. Like everyone works in an architect office, industrial design firm or print marketing agency.
In the grand scheme of things the people who NEED to run Photoshop or CAD programs are edge cases.
The real reason people need windows for work is non-technical corporate and government IT departments. Windows management software (eg. Exchange) is too deeply embedded in the organisation and it is too time consuming and expensive to remove.
You are not logged in. However you can subscribe from another Fediverse account, for example Lemmy or Mastodon. To do this, paste the following into the search field of your instance: !linux@lemmy.ml
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).
Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word “Linux” in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.
Rules
Posts must be relevant to operating systems running the Linux kernel. GNU/Linux or otherwise.
I emotionally understand this idealistic view. But you can’t exclude yourself from the economy and exclude yourself from professional collaboration of any kind by switching from Photoshop to GIMP.
Professional software linux still doesn’t support:
Solidworks
AutoCAD
any DWG viewer
Photoshop has no good alternative on Linux though that’s a very real reason to need windows
Personally I’m too cheap for a Photoshop license anyway so doesn’t bother me but some people need it
Fun fact about Photoshop, the windows version doesn’t have feature parity with the Mac version, that’s why so many graphic designers use Mac.
Oh really? When I used it on windows I couldn’t move for features and this was years ago. Crazy to think it’s got even more on mac
Proprietary software I use on a regular basis with no Linux alternative:
Revit, AutoCAD, Houdini, 3dsMAX, SolidWorks, Rhino, Grasshopper, Adobe Illustrator/Photoshop/InDesign (and/or their Affinity alternatives), CUDA optimized simulation and rendering plugins, etc.
I use at least one of these every day, almost none of them have any functioning compatibility with Wine or other emulation. Even just using Affinity has caused some issues with team projects when someone picks up where I left off and there’s no layer information and a ton of clipping groups instead.
If all you do with your computer is program, work with documents, use a web browser, and play video games sure go wild don’t use Windows on any of your machines. But I just don’t understand how some people in the FOSS community cannot fathom that there are entire professional workflows and industries that just have zero possibility of moving to Linux.
Do I like using Windows? No. But I do like being able to use all the programs my work and research requires.
I contribute actual, tangible research into FOSS CAD/CAM/BIM software development and implementation. I love it and want to see FOSS options grow and become widely adopted. But it just isn’t anywhere close to having feature parity. And that matters, just as much as industry interoperability matters.
I’m just so tired of this thought process in the community that the only reason someone isn’t using Linux/FOSS is because they’re some fanboy or something
Um… Houdini is on Linux & (unofficial) SOLIDWORKS-for-Linux exists.
I feel fortunate that I don’t rely on software that’s not on Linux, unfortunately very much not the case for all
It’s a chicken-egg problem. People stay away from Linux because Linux can’t run (or at least very flawed) industry standard programs like Adobes catalogue and those proprietary software publishers wont publish for Linux because there aren’t enough Linux users to be worth the “trouble”.
But that’s just a part of the problem, the true offender, are the goalpost-movers. “Linux cant run A, that’s why I NEED to stay on windows. What? A now runs flawlessly? Well there’s also B which is really important!” No matter how many programs get ported or at least near flawlessly emulated, there will always be one more program our jack-of-all-trades absolutely can’t live without.
To be honest, sometimes it’s just easier to use Windows, for compatibility sake. Sure, I can install Office or Photoshop through Wine, but some software can just be a pain in the neck to install and use on Linux.
This is the main reason why I dual boot and will most probably for a very very long time. I just don’t have the time to tackle with these things ATM, real life is more important.
There is a trade off i guess if you put it that way. Would you rather tinker and make your software work for you, or would you install a shitty bloated operating system that routinely trades your data like pokemon cards just so you can install a handful of programs.
Real change requires real change
I would rather tinker to be honest, I am that kind of a person, but currently, my family (kid) needs me. He’s young and needs guidance, playing, attention, etc. That is more important than tinkering with tech IMO.
Yeah, let me just change my profession real quick, fuck the 20 years I have invested. I’ll just do a tapdance on my eyelashes for the neckbeards and everybody will be happy weee
LOL wait till the company your proprietary software relies on tanks or makes a shitty change for their benefit.
It’s sad you built a career out of black box code lmao. I guess 20 years isn’t enough to read the writing on the wall: proprietary code is shit. Black boxes are shit. I piss on your profession
Companies are always going to make shitty changes, but that doesn’t change the reality that industry leaders are usually in that position for a reason. You simply cannot replace After Effects without kneecapping yourself. GIMP is nowhere near as capable as Photoshop. It is impossible to develop iOS apps without Xcode, and difficult/unsupported to develop Android without Android Studio.
You can piss off your high horse as much as you want, but it is fantastical to claim that professions should hamstring their work and sacrifice reality and practicality for the sake of some ideology belief. Companies aren’t choosing these standards because they love giving away money, they’re doing it because they recognise that rejecting a $300 annual expense for $10,000 worth of greater productivity is financially irresponsible.
You should be BANNED
See this neckbeard extremist evangelising is why people stay away from Linux community. Linux hobbyists having 0 concerns for others’ jobs, work or needs is incredibly icky. I advocate for FLOSS, but posts like this just gives more ammunition to Windows/MacOS/proprietary culture fanboys.
OP said this to a poster below:
Is there any collection of such inspirational / wisdom quotes?
If not, then one should be started.
And this quote should be added to it.
I expected the classic “be the change that you wabt to see in the world”, but despite being similar, this one is very good as well.
They’re right though. Top of the line software for certain domains (CAD, photoshop) just doesn’t exist for Linux. As much as I would want it to be.
Is it that top of the line software truly doesn’t exist for linux, that it’s impossible to the work done, or is it possible BUT you have to spend more time tinkering and learning the quirks of quite admittedly rough around the edges open source software? That yes, it’s less efficient, but actually more rewarding knowing that the software you worked on was open source. And one you actually learn how to use open source software, nobody can take it away from you.
Look at unity! They gutted the program through its egregious licensing structure and now people are scrambling for alternatives. People that sticked with Godot didn’t have the same trouble. It was just another Wednesday
Of course open source can’t play on the same level as proprietary software right now. It doesn’t have the same money thrown at it than proprietary software! But the appeal of open source is that every change is guaranteed to benefit you, not some arbitrary bottom line. Proprietary software is polished, but you are at the whims of a big tech company.
If i were to base my profession on software, spend literal years of my life depending on code, i really would fucking like to look inside that shit sometimes. Anything else is like building a skyscraper out of quicksand
It’s great to use open source software. But once you need to use CAD for work, you’re gonna use the most efficient tool you can find no matter what OS it requires.
Also you CAN get your workplace to shift over to something else.
Not every workplace will change procedures, but some will. Especially if it’s software that handles local data or if there are high costs or privacy risks, they can be convinced.
Can you tho?
You’re gonna get a whole team of people retrained with software they’re not used to, probably doesn’t have proper support or learning resources to fall back on, and may lack features or compatibility?
They might save some money, but a lot of businesses are more than happy to pay a lot to ensure they don’t have to worry about the above, and they can get on with their company’s actual purpose.
Well companies continue to get new software and learn new skills. They might not switch as soon as you suggest it, but it could get revisited later on when renewing a contract.
This also depends a lot on the size of the team and the work that’s being done. If required features are missing or there are compatibility issues, then that’s one thing. If people prefer the other product, or enough workers share similar views on the topic, then it’s easier to switch.
Again it doesn’t happen all the time, but it’s worth bringing up. If anything, it shows you’re thinking about how to improve your work and the business (financially, ethically). I’ve seen times when changes were made, and I’ve seen times when it wasn’t.
Like the jump from Windows 10 to Windows 11? People move to unfamiliar software all the time, then complain about it for a bit and then cope.
Windows 10 and 11 are the same product, just a new version…
They’re also extremely similar (damn near identical), and if you currently use windows 10 then eventually you’ll have no option but move to 11…
A new version that removed several features and changed others.
That is obviously wrong. Start menu and task bar changed a lot from Win7 to Win8, the from Win8 to Win10, and again from Win10 to Win11.
I hope you are kidding, trolling, as those things, plus audio/video editing, started fron unix when it wasn’t conceivable to do so on PCs with proprietary OS. All those corporations who later sold such sw copied/stole FOSS and dressed it up as their own.
No team or corporation can ever ever catch up to FOSS development. It is a neo-liberal fallacy that promotes them on marketing hype.
@adeoxymus @aldalire
Yeah, but people who bring these things up act like everyone needs these things to get their day to day work done. Like everyone works in an architect office, industrial design firm or print marketing agency.
In the grand scheme of things the people who NEED to run Photoshop or CAD programs are edge cases.
The real reason people need windows for work is non-technical corporate and government IT departments. Windows management software (eg. Exchange) is too deeply embedded in the organisation and it is too time consuming and expensive to remove.